Information about WC 2005

[A.Presman]

Message from Eleonora Bubbi
Sent via FMJD website
Information about WC 2005

In the CD-meeting of April 23/24 is decided:

1. Playing time will be: 50 moves in 2 hours, after that one hour per player to the end.
2. Dividing players: 40 players divided in 4 groups of 10 players. Three of them to the final.
3. Final will be played with 12 players.
4. Schedule:
a. Preliminaries: October 6 (Opening+ Round 1)
October 7 (Round 2 + 3)
October 8 (Round 4)
October 9 (Round 5 + 6)
October 10 (Round 7)
October 11 (Round 8)
October 12 (Round 9)
b. Day of rest: October 13
c. Final: October 14 (Round 1)
October 15 (Round 2)
October 16 (Round 3)
October 17 (Round 4 + 5)
October 18 (Round 6)
October 19 (Round 7)
October 20 (Round 8)
October 21 (Round 9)
October 22 (Round 10)
October 23 (Round 11 and closing)
5. Main-referee: Heinar Jahu (Estonia)
Assistants: Henk Fokkink (The Netherlands)
Ndongo Fall (Senegal)
Cor Verdel (The Netherlands)
DaniÊl Mullier (Belgium) or Mackowiak (Poland)
6. In the final the two Dutch referees will be assistants of Jahu.
7. About selection players there will come informations within short time.

Gniezno, 24 april 2005

[Michele_Borghetti]

Message from Eleonora Bubbi
Sent via FMJD website
Information about WC 2005

In the CD-meeting of April 23/24 is decided:

1. Playing time will be: 50 moves in 2 hours, after that one hour per player to the end.

I think (and, sorry, i know) play whit system 1 hour (or different time) and than you lose a game, is very very dangerous.
Pity, in a world championship they don't think about how much is important the endgame.
We have to write all the complete game, all moves?
I think will be very difficoult write moves whit 5 seconds.
If we can dont write the moves, ....will be not possible for the funs of dammen see all complete games.
Michele

[Alexander Kandaurov]

.will be not possible for the funs of dammen see all complete games. Michele

Hi Michele!

If FMJD or KNDB wants they can buy draughts electronic boards.
It will do possible save all games untill last move for history:lol:

Anybody can check recognazion quality download a short movie (15 Megabytes) with my comments here - http://www.fmjd.org/video/mov1.wmv

BR, Alexander

[Peter van Heun]

Maybe the FMJD can publish the participants who are certain to play?

[E. Bubbi]

PLAYER COUNTRY

WC2003 - 1 - 6
Georgiev Alexander Russia 1
Tsjizov Alexeij Russia 2
Valneris Guntis Latvia 3
Sybrands Ton Holland 4
Jansen Gerard Holland 5
Thijsen Kees Holland 6

Countries that pay fee 390 euro

Gantwarg Anatoli Belarus 7
Jansen Hans Holland 8
Borghetti Michele Italy 9
Chmiel Piotr Poland 10
? Lithuania 11
? Ukraine 12
? Russia 13
? France 14

CHALLENGE 2005 GNIEZNO
Husjenov Fahrad Azerbaidjan 15
Nicault Laurent France 16
Podolsky Marc Germany 17
Heusdens Ron Holland 18
Misans Robert Latvia 19
Bouzinski Edvard Lithuania 20
Getmanski Alexander Russia 21
Kirzner Igor Ukraina 22

CONFEDERATION CHAMPIONS
Ba Bassirou Senegal 23 - AFRICA
Schwarzmann Alexander Russia 24 - EUROPA
? 25 - ASIA
? 26 - PANAMERICA

AFRICAN COUNTRIES
? Burkina Faso 27
? Cameroon 28
? Guinee 29
? Mali 30
? Senegal 31
Ndjofang Jean Marc prop.CAJD 32

ASIAN COUNTRIES
? India 33
? Mongolia 34

OCEANIA COUNTRY
? Australia 35

PANAMERICAN COUNTRIES
? Brazil 36
? Curaçao 37
? Haiti 38


SPONSOR PLACE 39
ORGANIZATION COMMITTEE 40

Reserves

1. Nosevitch Sergeij - Belarus
2. Wollaert Bryan - Belgium
3. Oderkiewicz P. - Poland

CD Gniezno - 23/24-04-2005
This is a provisional list of names of players.
FMJD is waiting from National Federations, correct informations about players names within 1.07.2005.
From 1.7.2005 - 31.8.2005 players can be changed always with players of the same National Federation.
Will be done a structured lottery early September, that will divide players in 4 groups of 10 players.
After early September players that cannot to partecipate will be replaced by reserves players.

Eleonora Bubbi
TDS

[Peter van Heun]

PLAYER COUNTRY

WC2003 - 1 - 6
Georgiev Alexander Russia 1
Tsjizov Alexeij Russia 2
Valneris Guntis Latvia 3
Sybrands Ton Holland 4
Jansen Gerard Holland 5
Thijsen Kees Holland 6

Countries that pay fee 390 euro

Gantwarg Anatoli Belarus 7
Jansen Hans Holland 8
Borghetti Michele Italy 9
Chmiel Piotr Poland 10
? Lithuania 11
? Ukraine 12
? Russia 13
? France 14

CHALLENGE 2005 GNIEZNO
Husjenov Fahrad Azerbaidjan 15
Nicault Laurent France 16
Podolsky Marc Germany 17
Heusdens Ron Holland 18
Misans Robert Latvia 19
Bouzinski Edvard Lithuania 20
Getmanski Alexander Russia 21
Kirzner Igor Ukraina 22

CONFEDERATION CHAMPIONS
Ba Bassirou Senegal 23 - AFRICA
Schwarzmann Alexander Russia 24 - EUROPA
? 25 - ASIA
? 26 - PANAMERICA

AFRICAN COUNTRIES
? Burkina Faso 27
? Cameroon 28
? Guinee 29
? Mali 30
? Senegal 31
Ndjofang Jean Marc prop.CAJD 32

ASIAN COUNTRIES
? India 33
? Mongolia 34

OCEANIA COUNTRY
? Australia 35

PANAMERICAN COUNTRIES
? Brazil 36
? Curaçao 37
? Haiti 38


SPONSOR PLACE 39
ORGANIZATION COMMITTEE 40

Reserves

1. Nosevitch Sergeij - Belarus
2. Wollaert Bryan - Belgium
3. Oderkiewicz P. - Poland

CD Gniezno - 23/24-04-2005
This is a provisional list of names of players.
FMJD is waiting from National Federations, correct informations about players names within 1.07.2005.
From 1.7.2005 - 31.8.2005 players can be changed always with players of the same National Federation.
Will be done a structured lottery early September, that will divide players in 4 groups of 10 players.
After early September players that cannot to partecipate will be replaced by reserves players.

Eleonora Bubbi
TDS

I conclude. Participants with definite possibility to start:

Ba, Bassirou - Senegal
Borghetti, Michele - Italy
Bouzinski, Edvard - Lithuania
Chmiel, Piotr - Poland
Gantwarg, Anatoli - Belarus
Georgiev, Alexander - Russia
Getmanski, Alexander - Russia
Heusdens, Ron - Holland
Husjenov, Fahrad - Azerbaidjan
Jansen, Gerard - Holland
Jansen, Hans - Holland
Kirzner, Igor - Ukraina
Misans, Robert - Latvia
Nicault, Laurent - France
Podolski, Marc - Germany
Sijbrands, Ton - Holland
Schwarzmann, Alexander - Russia
Thijsen, Kees - Holland
Tsjizov, Alexeij - Russia
Valneris, Guntis - Latvia

Total at may 1, 2005: 20

[Hanco Elenbaas]

Gisteren vond in Maarsbergen een vergadering van de FMJD bestuur plaats.

Officiele notulen komen er pas later.
Ik heb vandaag met Dhr. Pawlicki contact gehad en heb hem gevraagd over de WK kwalificatie.
Volgens hem (informatie is nog niet officiel maar wel betrouwbaar) ziet de kwalificatie schema nu als volgt uit.

============================================
WCh: 40 players
6 places - from last WCh
1 sponsor place
1 organizing federation
5 America
3 Asia
1 Oceania
7 Africa
16 Europe:
8 - from countries most active with regulary good relationship (fees in full amount) last few year: Russia, Holland, Belarus, Lithuania, Ukraina, Poland, Italy, France
8 - via qualification tournament for Europa for ALL countries.
Some additional conditions : maximum 5 players from countries. America, Asia, Africa - number of countries should be equeal to number of places or maximum diference of one - it means minimum 6 african countries.
In qualifacation tournament for Europe - 8 places for ... 8 players from 8 different countries. Each federation can play (also Russia, Holland, ..)
============================================

PLAYER COUNTRY

WC2003 - 1 - 6
Georgiev Alexander Russia 1
Tsjizov Alexeij Russia 2
Valneris Guntis Latvia 3
Sybrands Ton Holland 4
Jansen Gerard Holland 5
Thijsen Kees Holland 6

Countries that pay fee 390 euro

Gantwarg Anatoli Belarus 7
Jansen Hans Holland 8
Borghetti Michele Italy 9
Chmiel Piotr Poland 10
? Lithuania 11
? Ukraine 12
? Russia 13
? France 14

CHALLENGE 2005 GNIEZNO
Husjenov Fahrad Azerbaidjan 15
Nicault Laurent France 16
Podolsky Marc Germany 17
Heusdens Ron Holland 18
Misans Robert Latvia 19
Bouzinski Edvard Lithuania 20
Getmanski Alexander Russia 21
Kirzner Igor Ukraina 22

CONFEDERATION CHAMPIONS
Ba Bassirou Senegal 23 - AFRICA
Schwarzmann Alexander Russia 24 - EUROPA
? 25 - ASIA
? 26 - PANAMERICA

AFRICAN COUNTRIES
? Burkina Faso 27
? Cameroon 28
? Guinee 29
? Mali 30
? Senegal 31
Ndjofang Jean Marc prop.CAJD 32

ASIAN COUNTRIES
? India 33
? Mongolia 34

OCEANIA COUNTRY
? Australia 35

PANAMERICAN COUNTRIES
? Brazil 36
? Curaçao 37
? Haiti 38


SPONSOR PLACE 39
ORGANIZATION COMMITTEE 40

Reserves

1. Nosevitch Sergeij - Belarus
2. Wollaert Bryan - Belgium
3. Oderkiewicz P. - Poland

CD Gniezno - 23/24-04-2005
This is a provisional list of names of players.
FMJD is waiting from National Federations, correct informations about players names within 1.07.2005.
From 1.7.2005 - 31.8.2005 players can be changed always with players of the same National Federation.
Will be done a structured lottery early September, that will divide players in 4 groups of 10 players.
After early September players that cannot to partecipate will be replaced by reserves players.

Eleonora Bubbi
TDS

I conclude. Participants with definite possibility to start:

Ba, Bassirou - Senegal
Borghetti, Michele - Italy
Bouzinski, Edvard - Lithuania
Chmiel, Piotr - Poland
Gantwarg, Anatoli - Belarus
Georgiev, Alexander - Russia
Getmanski, Alexander - Russia
Heusdens, Ron - Holland
Husjenov, Fahrad - Azerbaidjan
Jansen, Gerard - Holland
Jansen, Hans - Holland
Kirzner, Igor - Ukraina
Misans, Robert - Latvia
Nicault, Laurent - France
Podolski, Marc - Germany
Sijbrands, Ton - Holland
Schwarzmann, Alexander - Russia
Thijsen, Kees - Holland
Tsjizov, Alexeij - Russia
Valneris, Guntis - Latvia

Total at may 1, 2005: 20

Gilles Delmotte wasn't in Gniezno, Poland because he already qualified by becoming Champion of France in 2004.

Aleksej Domchev wrote us that in Lithuania there will be a match between four: Domchev, Petryla, Volosionkin, Kudriavcev.

Isn't Yuri Anikeev champion of Ukraine?

Dutch federation KNDB gave organization place to Alexander Baliakine. This was confirmed by Mr. Ruurd Wuestman, the competion leader.

Sponsor place almost certainly will go to Rob Clerc, I understood from Mr. Hildering.



In the competition conditions of the 12th PanAmerican championship in Haiti there was written that the numbers 1 and 2 qualified for the world championship in 2005. Why Anthony Alexandre and Louicéus Shang Wong aren't part of Mrs. Bubbi's scheme?

Isn't Suriname a member anymore? Didn't they pay their 390 Euro fee?
And what about Canada and USA? Don't they have a chance in next PanAm in Montreal? Only players from Brasil, Curaçao and Haiti can qualify in Montreal?

Why America doesn't have 5 places anymore as Mr. Pawlicki wrote in January? Europe has one more now. Is that because of Suriname?

[Guest]

From Forum French Draughts Federation http://ffjd.free.fr/ where Mr. Fabrice Maggiore, champion of Guadeloupe, and 5th on the 12th PanAm in Haiti, writes:

Scandale à la FMJD: Henk FOKKING et Consorts

Message envoyé par Fabrice MAGGIORE Le 01/05/2005 02:54:29

Salut à tous,

Pendant que les parisens s'affrontent en finale ( le contraire m'étonnerait du fait du t----e d----é ) , mon attention a été attirée par les annonces officielles et d'ailleurs non officielles parues sur les différentes rubriques du forum de la FMJD.

Notamment sur la parution de la liste des joueurs pour le WK 2005 émise par Eléonore BUBBI et la liste émise par Hanco Elenbaas.

Voici ce qu'il en ressort:

Les zones Afrique et Panamérique sont taxées ( AFRIQUE) des numéros 23 ( Champion en titre: BASSIROU BA ) 27, 28, 29,30,31 et 32 ( Réservé ), et ( Panamérique) 26 ( Champion en titre: ALEXANDRE ), 36, 37 et 38.

Je laisse aux africains commenter ce scandale, même si j'en parlerai plus tard. Quand aux panaméricains, trois pays sont désignés: Brazil, Curacao et Haiti sur la liste officielle de la FMJD. Pays venus de nulle part?

Sur le document de Mr HELENBAAS, pour l'Afrique, il est mentionné 7 pays avec un point d' intérogation et pour la zone panaméricaine, il est mentionné WONG et AlEXANDRE plus trois autres qui seront connus au 13 ème panaméricain de Montréal.

Tout d'abord, une chose est sûre c'est que WONG et ALEXANDRE représenteront la zone panaméricaine en octobre 2005 à Amsterdam..
Pourquoi, parce qu'à HAITI, en janvier 2004, il en a été décidé ainsi. Seulement voilà, entre temps les règles du jeu( d'ailleurs au propre comme au figuré ) ont évoluées et c' est 5 joueurs qui représenteront la Zone Panaméricaine. Contrairement au document de Mme BUBBI qui fait apparaître 4 qualifiés.

Pourquoi ALEXANDRE ne figure pas en position 26 sur le document de Mme BUBBI?
Pourquoi WONG n'y figure pas.
Pourquoi WONG et ALEXANDRE figurent sur le document de Mr HELENBAAS?
Pourquoi BRAZIL, CURACAO et HAITI figurent sur le document de Mme BUBBI?
Pourquoi Mr HELENBAAS parle du 13 ème panaméricain pour les qualifiés restants? C'est un mystère délirant.

Pourquoi la PADCF( l'instance panaméricaine) n'a pas été informée par la FMJD pour qu'elle informe à son tour ses adhérents. Ce n'est pas au mois de mai 2005 que l'on change les règles du jeu à trois mois d'un nouveau zonal. Haiti 2004 reste la référence comme le réglement particulier de ce zonal le stipulait.

Sincèrement je trouve tout cela incohérent.

Soit Mme BUBBI se trompe et elle a bien raison de dire que c'est une liste prévisionnelle, soit Mr ELENBBAAS est bien informé, alors la FMJD n'assume pas son rôle de fédérateur, elle qui voulait un championnat planétaire. Je ne vous parle même pas de la zone OCEANIE qui est un scandale de plus. Un autre hollandais se qualifiera également.

D'ailleurs, les français dirigeants devraient prendre exemple sur leurs homologues néerlandais qui se sont octroyés une place pour le sponsoring et une place pour le commité d'organisation: ce n'est pas un gag.On peut dire que Henk FOKKING a fait fort sur ce coup là.

Gilles DELMOTTE n'apparait pas en N°14. On connait le Champion d'Italie ou de Pologne mais on ne connait pas le Champion de France?

On connait le Champion d'EUROPE mais on ne connait pas le Champion de la PANAMERICA? On connait à priori le Champion d'Afrique:ouf.

Soit, les deux haitiens sont qualifiés et on prend les trois suivants en fonction du résultat d'Haiti 2004 soit Guadeloupe, Brazil et Curacao.

On ne va quand même pas revivre ce que la zone Europe vient de connaître en donnant une seconde chance aux pays dominants. C'est un caprice de la FMJD comme le disait Wieger WESSELINK. Il ajoutait même que s'il était à la place de SEKONGO, il se rendrait en Octobre à Amsterdam pour réclamer.

Pourquoi, parce que l'Afrique a droit à 7 joueurs de pays différent imposés par la commission.

Tout cela ne rend pas la plus haute instance de jeu de dames très crédible.

Pourquoi la FMJD s'est précipitéé à diffuser une liste incomplète, fausse laissant planer une suspicion légitime à l'endroit de la commission orchestrée par Mr FOKKIN?.

[Hanco Elenbaas]

Je ne vous parle même pas de la zone OCEANIE qui est un scandale de plus. Un autre hollandais se qualifiera également.

Excuse me Mr. Maggiore, but you didn't understand that my remark concerning the match between former Dutchies Eran Binenbaum and Dominique de Rooij in Oceania was a joke!
Like Mrs Bubbi, I don't know yet who's coming from Oceania.

[Hanco Elenbaas]

Dutch masters Casper van der Tak (from Bejing, China) and Tjalling Goedemoed (Leeuwarden) agreed completely with Malick Niang and Adelin Bikindou, who wrote on forum FFJD during the tournament in Gniezno:

J'ai l'impression que ce tournoi qualificatif regroupe des damistes de niveau trop inégal. Je trouve qu'il y a trop de défaites.
Par ailleurs la règle ne permettant qu'un qualifié par pays est trop injuste. Getmanski et Milshin suivent de près, au classement, Poldosky, mais un seul des deux sera qualifié. Le jeu de dames est perdante avec une telle règle. J'espère que la confédération européenne aura la sagesse de changer cette règle qui est vraiment stupide. Comme pratiquement tous les pays européens étaient assurés d'être représentés au prochain championnat du monde en raison de la sélection d'office des vainqueurs sortants des championnats nationaux, le tournoi qualificatif actuellement disputé aurait dû permettre de ne retenir que les concurrents les mieux classés, indépendamment des considérations de nationalité.
BIKINDOU ADELIN

Effectivement BIKINDOU ADELIN, j'avais écrit la même chose récemment sur ce forum; cela m'avait valu des critiques acerbes de la part de certains internautes, et je m'étais tû. Heureusement que tu me rejoins.
Fait attention, les gens n'aiment pas entendre certaines vérités.

Malick Niang
Kaolack Sénégal

Le même principe est valable également pour l'Afrique, la FMJD doit rectifier pendant qu'il est encore temps.

Malick Niang
Kaolack Sénégal

[Jacques PERMAL]

I think that the final of 2005 WC should be played in ROUEN between HANCO ELENBAAS and JACQUES PERMAL !!

It was the joke of this beautiful sunday !!

Photo of FABRICE MAGGIORE during PANAM championship of CAP-HAITIEN

[E. Bubbi]

Hundreds witness, one hundred ideas.
They want information, then critical if come given, even if recognize, are partial.
Names are known, but FMJD waited for written communications official, from Federations and Confederations.
The Federations that not are you see Panamerica or Africa, are not present why they have not poured the affiliation tax.
The 2 Confederations know it and agree.
Oceania has right to a place being one country Australia and also a continent.
A championship of the world previews the world, not only the force of the players.
The only correct information is those that come given from the members of the CD of the FMJD.
That’s all, until 2 July.
Eleonora Radin Bubbi
DTS

[Jacques PERMAL]

Of course each federation (or confederation) should pay the fees affiliation to FMJD.

[Hanco Elenbaas]

Hundreds witness, one hundred ideas.
They want information, then critical if come given, even if recognize, are partial.
Names are known, but FMJD waited for written communications official, from Federations and Confederations.
The Federations that not are you see Panamerica or Africa, are not present why they have not poured the affiliation tax.
The 2 Confederations know it and agree.
Oceania has right to a place being one country Australia and also a continent.
A championship of the world previews the world, not only the force of the players.
The only correct information is those that come given from the members of the CD of the FMJD.
That’s all, until 2 July.
Eleonora Radin Bubbi
DTS

Thank you for information Mrs. Bubbi, I appreciate that you are willing to do this.
However, apparently also the information from members of the FMJD's CD is not correct and sometimes one member says something different than another one.
Nevertheless thanks again for your attempt to inform us and we'll meet again on July 2nd!

[Fabrice MAGGIORE]

Good evening with all,

First of all before addressing to me to you Mr. ELENBAAS and Mrs. BUBBI, I allow myself to draw your attention to copy-sticking it this anonymity which reproduced my post emitted on the site of the FFJD towards the forum of the FMJD. If I had wanted that it appears to with it, I could do it myself; each one has its own reasons and convictions to make what it likes.

I also draw the attention of Mr. Jacques PERMAL to the inopportunity to diffuse photographs without the approval of sound or his authors, infringement punished by the French Penal code. I am also saddened by the behavior of Mr. PERMAL who used this mistake at my place. I add that these mutiposts daily versed on the various sites (and in particular its post followed by my photograph) has as as result to irritate a good number of French damists who quite simply drew aside it considering his narrow-mindedness.

I am really sorry to use this space to position back the things, remarks certainly painful but necessary from time to time. Now that the things are said, as regards the subject itself, I allowed myself to make a comparison between an incomplete list emitted by the office of the FMJD and that of Mr. ELENBAAS.

What leads me to develop several interrogations:

Firstly: how members of such a large Confederation in term of distance can know as the aforementioned confederation does not have to pour its right of affiliation. I draw your attention that here in America, the damic nations only meet very episodically.

Secondo: I rather seldom traverse the forum of the FMJD and I did not follow all your discussions. All the more written in English or Dutch, it is very difficult to have a translation right while passing by a software, which led me to take with the first degree your Joke as you said. I amndt sorry for this incomprehension.

Thirdly: Can you Mrs. BUBBI inform me on Confération Panaméricaine concerning the reason on the presence of the countries BRAZIL, CURACAO and HAITI on your list?

Fourthly: Can you explain me Mr. ELENBAAS the evocation of the 13th PANAM in Montreal in July 2005 to precisely know 3 the qualified additional ones whereas in my opinion, that of HAITI 2004 should be taken more especially as there was no information having milked with three qualified additional by the means of the zonal one of Montreal and that in my opinion it is really late to take Vacation and to reserve very expensive plane tickets in three months of the expiry.

Quinto: I benefit from it to expose the case of the Guadeloupe which forms integral part of the Pan-American zone since it took part in the majority of the zonal ones. Can one hope for a participation of this country in the Championship of the world because of his membership in the aforementioned zone. You will understand easily that it is very difficult with a player inhabitant of Guadeloupe to take part in the French competitions. I want of it for proof that it is impossible for us to propose a team for a participation out of Cut of France. Can one hope for an evolution of this particular case when one realizes certain derogatory exemptions if I then to say in favour of dominant nations. As recalled by Mrs. BUBBI, it is a Championship of the planetary world.

While waiting to read you, please receive Madam, Mister my sincerity. Sincerely. Fabrice MAGGIORE